Living With Linkwitz

[suttondesign]

Now that I've got my Linkwitz LXmini more-or-less final, simplified down to a MiniDSP 4x10HD and a 4-channel Hypex-based amp from Nord, I feel I ought to report how truly amazing these little things are. I have heard and owned so many different speakers and speaker designs since the late 1970's, and nothing, for me, comes close to the transparency and holographic quality of the Linkwitz designs. I had Orions for many years and came to take them for granted. After I sold them last year in anticipation of newer and better things, even very expensive box speakers still sounded like boxes to me. I've never been able to live with the limitations of planars and electrostatics.

When operated at reasonable volume levels and with nothing more than a quality subwoofer to pick up the lowest notes, the LXMini are just mind blowing when it comes to imaging. I don't have the ability, right now, to locate the Linkwitz subs around the room, so the transition from active sub to LXMini could be better, and the naturalness of open-baffle woofers isn't there. But for the money and the payoff in imaging, you owe it to yourself to build these if you can scavenge 4 channels of modest amplification to run them.

 

[Ron Texas]

Do you have any issues with the MiniDSP 2x4 such as audible noise or hum? It doesn't measure well compared to most recent DAC's, but is it good enough?

 

[suttondesign]

There was some residual noise at 1 meter from the little full-range driver, but I cannot isolate it as between the 2x4 and the old Adcom 4-channel amp I was using. I tested the newly-built system with the 2x4 HD and the old amp (which I picked up on craigslist for the purpose) just to be sure I had built it correctly. Once I knew I had, I immediately switched over to the MiniDSP 4x10 HD and commenced with tweaking and finalizing the DSP settings. Then, a few days ago, I got the Nord 4-channel Hypex amp with the 250-watt modules. I now have to stick my ear right against the FR driver to hear anything, and I'm not sure whether I hear anything from the little woofer, possibly a bit. From 1 foot away, complete silence and zero 60hz noise. It is at least as quiet as the Dutch & Dutch 8C and possibly quieter. Whether the system would benefit from one of the newer, transparent DAC's I do not know. I assume that at some point, that tech will trickle down to companies like MiniDSP, and then I'll know!

 

[Ron Texas]

@suttondesign could you do a noise check with the MiniDSP 2x4 and the Nord amp? Not necessary to get the filters exactly right on the 2x4.

 

[suttondesign]

No, because I already sold the 2x4.

 

[jeffbook]

There was some residual noise at 1 meter from the little full-range driver, but I cannot isolate it as between the 2x4 and the old Adcom 4-channel amp I was using. I tested the newly-built system with the 2x4 HD and the old amp (which I picked up on craigslist for the purpose) just to be sure I had built it correctly. Once I knew I had, I immediately switched over to the MiniDSP 4x10 HD and commenced with tweaking and finalizing the DSP settings. Then, a few days ago, I got the Nord 4-channel Hypex amp with the 250-watt modules. I now have to stick my ear right against the FR driver to hear anything, and I'm not sure whether I hear anything from the little woofer, possibly a bit. From 1 foot away, complete silence and zero 60hz noise. It is at least as quiet as the Dutch & Dutch 8C and possibly quieter. Whether the system would benefit from one of the newer, transparent DAC's I do not know. I assume that at some point, that tech will trickle down to companies like MiniDSP, and then I'll know!

Your experience mirrors mine as far as noise performance is concerned. My original setup on my LXmini system used Adcom 2545 amps for both the LXmini and my Orion dipole bass modules. I replaced both Adcoms with an 8 channel Nord Ncore amp and used RCA to XLR cables I constructed from two conductor mic cable using the Rane tech note on audio connections, and noise and hum was virtually eliminated. The Adcom 2535 amp has the reputation for adverse hum and noise, and I have measured them and confirmed this. The LXminis really have to be heard to be believed, particularly when subs are well integrated with them.

If I could hear them with high end 8 channel DAC (Okto?) or 3 or 4 really good balanced output DAC units fed by a 2 channel DSP engine of equal quality running through the Nord amp, it would make for an interesting comparison to the miniDSP solution.

 

[Soniclife]

What practical room considerations are needed for this type of speaker? Can they work in relatively small living rooms, or do they require very selfish installs?

 

[jeffbook]

My room is 12.5 ft wide, 10 ft long, and 7.5 ft. high. They can be used near field, but should form an approximate equilateral triangle with respect to the primary listening position. They are also small and light enough to be easily moved with a room to optimize performance.

 

[JP]

Mine are a 6’ equilateral. Most important is having them at least 3’ away from walls.

Using Okto dac 8 dsp and three Benchmark AHB2. You can stick your ear through the cone if you want, you’re not hearing any noise.

 

[suttondesign]

Mine media room is 18 long by 13 wide x 9 high. The 65" TV is on a 13' wall, and the LXmini sit out about 30", flanking the screen and doing double-duty as home theater and music server speakers. They are about 1 meter from each side wall.

The output is ample for my needs -- I never turn this system up very loud, and a devoted active 12" sub in a corner handles the deep bass. Because the phantom center is so stable, no center-channel needed.

Visually, these speakers when painted metallic dark bronze appear very small, though somewhat steampunk.

 

[suttondesign]

Using Okto dac 8 dsp

Really? I didn't understand that the Okto was a DSP engine. Can you do crossover filters and parametric EQ for each channel?

 

[suttondesign]

I am considering, long-term, building the Nelson Pass ASP so that I can use a top-flight DAC ahead of the ASP. Since I'm a dealer in the DAC's, that part won't cost me much, and the ASP is not very expensive to build.

 

[HemiRick]

I

@suttondesign could you do a noise check with the MiniDSP 2x4 and the Nord amp? Not necessary to get the filters exactly right on the 2x4.

I use a HD miniDSP2x4 and the only adverse effect on my system is a little loss of gain. No audible noise.

 

[JP]

Really? I didn't understand that the Okto was a DSP engine. Can you do crossover filters and parametric EQ for each channel?

Sadly NLA as miniDSP stopped selling the nanoSharc. I was lucky to find one second hand.

 

[Senior NEET Engineer]

Because the phantom center is so stable, no center-channel needed.

The purpose of center channel is to anchor the sound to the screen, regardless of how far off axis the viewer is. A good phantom center doesn't negate the benefits of a physical center channel.

 

[direstraitsfan98]

maybe he's the only one who uses his home theater

 

[suttondesign]

no, my kids use it too, but there’s no good way to rig up a center with an lxmini!

 

[Juhazi]

I've never heard LXmini, but I can imagine/guess how they sound, because having done some pretty similar speakers. If subwoofer(s) are used, one can make the woofer's box much smaller for the C speaker in multiway. Sealed 8 liter could be just fine and desktop size.The real problem comes from positioning a dipole as C. Overall, easier to use normal box speaker as C.

In my living room I use multiway dipoles for stereo and HT's mains. C and rear speakers are small boxed speakers. Integration is not very good because they have different crossover topology and thus different phase/GD in midrange-treble. This messes imaging, but I listen mostly 2ch and wife is not sopicky with movies/drama sound.

I have several 2x4HD and 4x10HD, and no hum or noise! Had some noise with unshielded RCA cables, but shielded are fine. Can't use balanced, which would be optimal. But then 2x4HD has only unbal RCA.

https://neurochrome.com/pages/minidsp-4x10hd#

 

[Burning Sounds]

The real problem comes from positioning a dipole as C.

Yes, this is my experience, too. I have a Maggie center speaker which I never use with my MG2.5rs as I didn't like the sound with the centre speaker in place. Measuring from the listening position showed lots of comb filtering. The central image is solid and stable enough without the centre speaker. I've never tried using a box speaker there, but I can see why it might be better.

 

[williamwally]

I had mine setup where casual/tv listening was almost against the back wall at greater distance than an equilateral triangle. But "serious" listening I would pull them off the back walls (~3ft back wall) and would listen at less than an equilateral. I think I preferred them probably 8ft wide with 6ft listening distance.
It's interesting to me how close you can get to the speaker plane before the stereo image collapses with these.