Newbie here, looking for input for upgrading my current 2-channel system

[ktm125]

Hi All:

I’ve been reading the threads here for suggestions in improving my 2 channel system.
My only music source is streaming and using a PS4 to access YouTube, Netflix, Amazon Prime, etc.
I have a TV connected to the system.

Current setup
PC
Emotiva UMC-200 preamp/processor
Emotiva RPA-2 amp
Legacy Audio Focus speakers
PS Audio Power Plant Premier Power Regenerator
TV

New DAC
Matrix Audio X-SABRE Pro seems the best but maybe the Topping or Sabaj would be good enough.
Since I’m only streaming music would it be best to get a DAC that connects to the internet, or run USB from PC to DAC?

Need to output TV audio to DAC.

New PC or upgrades
If PC is required, then what upgrades or new PC is recommended?

New Preamp
Do I need one?
And if so, which one?

New Amp
Benchmark AHB2

Speakers
Budget for new speakers is 10K, but prefer to keep current speakers if they won’t be the weak link.

TV
All the video sources connect to the UMC-200 via HDMI, but since the DACs have no HDMI, I can use the TV as a video input selector.

 

[SimpleTheater]

The number one improvement would be to your room.

Take a look at this thread.
https://audiosciencereview.com/foru...story-theory-without-measurement.7127/page-20

 

[ScofieldKid]

My first thought was a Oppo UDP-205 on the used market... Should work as both a USB-DAC for the PC, and as an Optical-IN for other stuff.
You can run the Oppo without a pre-amp if you want. My second thought was that if you are using a tablet, some of the tablets can see USB dacs, so that can give you a dedicated streaming device using whatever DAC. So like Ipad connected to an RME Adi-2 Dac for a dedicated streaming setup (assuming they are compatible.)

 

[Jim B]

Your speakers arn’t the weak link. They still use them in many recording studios.
If you want to change your sound, I would change your amp/preamp.

I use the new McIntosh 462 amp and c52 preamp with the Legacy Focus Se new versions. It has 3.0db headroom and sounds incredible. It’s 450. Watts per channel and made a huge difference from upgrading to a 150 watt per channel amp. Those dual 12” woofers really came alive.

I have the Cambridge Audio 851n network streamer. It uses the AD1955 dac. It sounds great, and works good. It also has optical inputs if you wanted to connect your optical out on the TV. However, if you just wanted to use the dac in the McIntosh, it uses an ESS dac and it’s sounds really good too.

 

[Twitch54]

The number one improvement would be to your room.

agreed wholeheartedly, I cringe when I hear/see folks trying to 'tune' their rigs with cables, etc without first optimizing their listening environment. Your speakers and where they live is #1 !!!

 

[Julf]

Your speakers arn’t the weak link. They still use them in many recording studios.
If you want to change your sound, I would change your amp/preamp.

Really? In my experience, the speakers (and room) have a much, much larger influence on the sound compared to the amp or DAC. What audible weaknesses do you think the current amps have?

 

[Daverz]

If you don't plan on adding any analog sources, I would suggest a DAC with hybrid volume control like the RME ADI-2 instead of a traditional pre-amp.

 

[Jim B]

Really? In my experience, the speakers (and room) have a much, much larger influence on the sound compared to the amp or DAC. What audible weaknesses do you think the current amps have?

Yes really. In my 45 years experience. People have a tendency to spend the most money on their speakers. But you can’t expect them to perform their best with just any old amp.

What weaknesses do I think his current pre amp and amp have? Well I’m not here to put down anyone’s equipment, as I think that would be rude.

But what I will say is that it begins with the quality of the recording. Bad recordings on great speakers can be very disheartening.
Then you have the input device, and then pre amp and amp.

Amps, amp design, they all sound different. So yes, changing your amp can greatly change your sound. Especially going from an AVR to a dedicated Stereo amp.

Right now I have five different stereo amps, with the same set of speakers they all sound different. One sounds bright, ones warm, one has lacking soundstage.....

On the other hand, I have brought home a new set of JBL’s speakers only to realize, it sounds pretty much the same as what It was supposed to replace because the amp is the same. It’s not like I had bad speakers to begin with.... However, introducing a room correction system, possibly an equalizer, having a more powerful amp, a preamp with a really nice dac in it...... That will really change the sound!

Amps and DACs have changed since his 2013 model AVR, he might want to take advantage of that.

The speakers he has now are one of the most highly reviewed and awarded speakers at the 10K price point. I’m not just saying that because I own them. I’m say that because many famous and talent recording engineers use them in mastering/remastering many artists. Even if he spent another 10k on speakers, he wouldn’t get a noticeable difference in sound quality. These speakers handle 750 watts per channel, and driving them with power it really opens them up.

 

[Thomas savage]

Room EQ and integrating some subs would be my advice. There's some amps and pre amps that will allow you to do that automatically. I use the Anthem STR.

You can chase gains buying random amps etc but its tail chasing work and you probably won't get any huge gains.

 

[Jim B]

If you don't plan on adding any analog sources, I would suggest a DAC with hybrid volume control like the RME ADI-2 instead of a traditional pre-amp.

Room EQ and integrating some subs would be my advice. There's some amps and pre amps that will allow you to do that automatically. I use the Anthem STR.

You can chase gains buying random amps etc but its tail chasing work and you probably won't get any huge gains.

Dude the last thing he needs is a sub. He already has 4 12” woofers. Just give them the power they need to turn on! Believe me I can rattle the walls if I want too...

Room eq is always a good bet.

But I think we need more information as too what his expectations are???

 

[anmpr1]

My first thought was a Oppo UDP-205 on the used market...)

Does someone want to take the chance with a second hand unit from a company that is out of the market? I understand Oppo is still supporting their devices under warranty. If you could get one cheap, I understand. But can you? A quick check on ebay showed the lowest price at 500.00. Most want four figures. That kind of money, for a used dvd player? To me it'd be a hard sell.

 

[Jim B]

Does someone want to take the chance with a second hand unit from a company that is out of the market? I understand Oppo is still supporting their devices under warranty. If you could get one cheap, I understand. But can you? A quick check on ebay showed the lowest price at 500.00. Most want four figures. That kind of money, for a used dvd player? To me it'd be a hard sell.

For that much money you could get a Sony 4K player that actually plays 4K and not just upscales

 

[BDWoody]

Dude the last thing he needs is a sub. He already has 4 12” woofers. Just give them the power they need to turn on! Believe me I can rattle the walls if I want too...

Room eq is always a good bet.

But I think we need more information as too what his expectations are???

It isn't about rattling the walls...that's the easy part... Sometimes the more the walls rattle the worse your problem gets...


To OP: I'd also suggest leaving your solid state stream alone, and really focus on your speaker(s) and room setup before you start to worry about whether a new DAC or preamp would make any meaningful difference.

 

[RayDunzl]

I’ve been reading the threads here for suggestions in improving my 2 channel system.

What's wrong with what you have?

 

[Jim B]

It isn't about rattling the walls...that's the easy part... Sometimes the more the walls rattle the worse your problem gets...


To OP: I'd also suggest leaving your solid state stream alone, and really focus on your speaker(s) and room setup before you start to worry about whether a new DAC or preamp would make any meaningful difference.

Do you have any idea how big these speakers are??? Chances are the go in the spot in the room where they fit. It’s not like he’s moving bookshelf speakers around!

 

[BDWoody]

Do you have any idea how big these speakers are??? Chances are the go in the spot in the room where they fit. It’s not like he’s moving bookshelf speakers around!

I'd think that's the very first thing he needs to do, yes.
That's always the first thing to do...

 

[RayDunzl]

Do you have any idea how big these speakers are??? Chances are the go in the spot in the room where they fit. It’s not like he’s moving bookshelf speakers around!

Legacy Focus SE

Dimensions HxWxD (inches): 55 x 14 x 15.375

---

My 'stats:

Dimensions: 71" × 18" × 13"

They've moved before.

 

[Ron Texas]

Buy a UMIK-1 Microphone, download REW and learn how to use it. You might also want Rephase, another free program. Keep your gear.

 

[TimW]

@ktm125 what is your listening room like? Have you taken any measurements of your speakers in your room?

 

[Blumlein 88]

Well depends on what you want to do. You mention speakers, and keeping it to $10k. Speakers will make the biggest difference though I don't know that yours are a problem. I'd agree with Ron Texas's post suggesting you get a Umik 1 and REW to see what you can do to help. But then I'd suggest that to everyone with much of an audio system. REW is free, and Umik 1 or similar is $100 or less.

If you wanted to change speakers, I might suggest investigating some Dutch&Dutch 8C speakers. They go for $13,500 a bit above your budget. But you only need a digital or analog feed to use them. You won't need anything else. If you were contemplating $10k in speakers, and the cost of the Benchmark amp, and the new DAC this is cheaper. Now whether they satisfy someone with your speakers (which are beautiful and have four 12 inch woofers) I don't know. You might wish to arrange hearing some to decide.

Kalman Rubinson who posts here reviewed them for Stereophile.
https://www.stereophile.com/content/dutch-dutch-8c-active-loudspeaker-system

There are plenty of other reviews.
https://www.soundstagehifi.com/index.php/equipment-reviews/1270-dutch-dutch-8c-active-loudspeakers

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/dutch-dutch-8c

If you keep your speakers, the DAC you've chosen looks like a good choice. The Benchmark would be an improvement over your current amp (and most amps), but it might not be a big difference in what you hear.

I'd forego a separate preamp. Does your TV have a digital output? If so you can use that to feed the DAC.