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Is Soekris dac1321 worth buying?

pkane

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I don't think we have all the tools on sound science.
I have read about military applications of sound advancements, like being able to point and place sounds/voices into victims heads.
Or military use for weaponizing.

Technology has advanced in all areas since the 70s and I don't see why it would not in all areas.

Think about it. Our military planes shown to us are about 20yrs old, before use of cellphones.
Then people wonder why they spot unusual activity in sky..
It is us all along.

I don't follow your logic. Just because you are not aware of advancements in audio and sound, doesn't mean that every one else is just as uninformed.

For example, the trick of hearing voices in your head is a pretty cool technology, but it's not magic and it's not restricted to military. You too can learn how it works if you just do a little reading ;)
 

March Audio

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This is why most users have more solid preferences when they are at home relaxed with thier gear.

You cannot pin everything on placibo.
To do that is to make excuses.

This is why most users have more solid biases when they are at home relaxed with thier gear.

Actually in my experience with audiophiles you pretty much can.
 

amirm

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It is simply not "normal" to listen to anything blindfolded. This in itself may cause a distraction of awareness that will mask normal brain activity in listening.
This is flawed because it is simply not normal and not how any person listens.
Oh? What is natural about comparing two DACs sighted? When you listen to music, you are not comparing gear. By that definition then, all audio evaluations are false.

Fact is that blind listening tests work excellently. I am able to find tiny differences that objectively there in audio using ABX tests. Vast majority of audiophiles however cannot. This means that they don't have critical listening abilities anyway. Therefore, any assessment they have of sound is false. Tested sighted or not.
 

amirm

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I don't think we have all the tools on sound science.
You think based on what? I read between 50 and 100 new audio papers a year. I keep the good ones for future reference. This is the stats on that folder:

1563257897241.png


How much have you read really? I assume the answer is a handful if that. Which is fine but please don't be dismissive of those of us who have dedicated our lives to learning about that science and summarizing it for others to learn. You don't dismiss the advice of your doctor when you are sick. Don't do that to us....
 

mansr

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A "piano tuner" gets paid to tune piano by ear.
NOT by measurements.
Rare is the piano tuner who doesn't use a tuning fork as a reference for the initial note (typically 440 Hz for the middle A). From there, the rest can be worked out through an elaborate sequence of ratios (relatively) easily identified by ear when two notes are played together. These days, it is common to use a microphone and electronic frequency meter to simply measure the frequency of each string and adjust until correct.
 

Maxx134

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Fact is that blind listening tests work excellently
No they don't because they all introduce doubt, unless you are the one switching the gear.
The doubt of wether the great has changed will ruin the results as it does introduce doubt.
Knowing a gear has been changed and knowing the whole chain of gear exept for the one change, (like a cable or dac of your own system) is a whole different approach wich is more real world and not unnatural as your blind testing where nothing is certain and nothing is known and no familiarity is present.
That scenario guarantees failure.
:)
 

Maxx134

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Rare is the piano tuner who doesn't use a tuning fork as a reference for the initial note (typically 440 Hz for the middle A). From there, the rest can be worked out through an elaborate sequence of ratios (relatively) easily identified by ear when two notes are played together. These days, it is common to use a microphone and electronic frequency meter to simply measure the frequency of each string and adjust until correct.
Sounds like your trying to downplay a piano tuner.
That is a talented skill and done by ear.
 

SIY

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No they don't because they all introduce doubt, unless you are the one switching the gear.

In every ABX test I'm aware of or have participated in, the user IS the one switching (or equivalently, controlling the switching). The only thing is that you have to use your ears, not peek. You can go back and forth as many times as you like and take all the time you want.

If you can tell A and B apart by just listening, you have confirmed that they sound different. If you can't tell A and B apart by just listening, then indeed they do not sound different to you. It's not complicated- perhaps you might want to try it yourself.
 

Maxx134

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How much have you read really? I assume the answer is a handful if that.
You are correct. I am least learned into research and an happy to learn so apologies for that.

I still have the belief system that you can percieve in real world reality without doubt.
 

amirm

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No they don't because they all introduce doubt, unless you are the one switching the gear.
The doubt of wether the great has changed will ruin the results as it does introduce doubt.
So your hearing is not good enough to overcome that doubt? If so, then you should reconsider if you are actually hearing what you think you are hearing.

It is not clear people have doubt anyway. When I was at Microsoft, we acquired Pacific Microsonics, inventors of HDCD format. After the acquisition, one of the guys working there asked me if I really believed in HDCD. I said of course and that the HDCD format was clearly audibly better than CD. Right then he hands me his headphone and says let's test. He then plays the very same test CD where I had heard the clear difference. He played one clip and then other. With confidence I turned to him and said the audible difference was clear as a day. And that I was shocked that he could not hear the same. My mood changed instantly after he told me both instances were the same! The obvious things I was "hearing" was not there at all.

So no, you are observations are wrong. Only when testing blind can we have confidence in the results. Otherwise your imagination creates differences every day of the week and twice on Sunday.

You need to have your hearing tested like above. Only then will you know how much to trust it.
 

Maxx134

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In every ABX test I'm aware of or have participated in, the user IS the one switching (or equivalently, controlling the switching). The only thing is that you have to use your ears, not peek. You can go back and forth as many times as you like and take all the time you want.

If you can tell A and B apart by just listening, you have confirmed that they sound differentI. f you can't tell A and B apart by just listening, then indeed they do not sound different to you. It's not complicated- perhaps you might want to try it yourself.
Yes i have done this allot **
Edit, I do not do A/B/X testing, only A/B as I don't have any trouble that would need it.
I have found differences easily and do it is hard for me to understand how anyone cannot hear a better system from another.
Probably most people are simply not into this or trained in listening .

I see many members here are super knowledgeable and I assumed they all have their preferences that they can point out so why deny it.
 
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pkane

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Sounds like your trying to downplay a piano tuner.
That is a talented skill and done by ear.

Not impressed. My phone can do the same, and with greater precision. Ask a piano tuner to name five random notes playing at the same time. My phone can do that.
 

Maxx134

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So no, you are observations are wrong. Only when testing blind can we have confidence in the results. Otherwise your imagination creates differences every day of the week and twice on Sunday.
I think it has to do with the mindset of "unfamiliarity", which causes the imagination to set in.

That's why I believe in judging/comparing one item at a time in your system.

I never have had any doubt in my life what I have heard.
I don't believe in the power of placibo lol.
 

Maxx134

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I do get it with impressions without actuall measurements.
Most people will buy based on sonic impression, and then take their new toy home to find out it does not sound like they wanted lol
 

amirm

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I don't believe in the power of placibo lol.
Well, that is unwise. But it is not just placebo that steers you wrong. It is the lack of understanding of our hearing works. We routinely change our perception of audio, from moment to moment. If this is not equalized in testing, which only occurs in blind tests, then you again get wrong results. There was a reason I thought in identical playback of the same track twice in a row, one had much higher fidelity, more air, more resolution, etc. I simply listened differently and read all that into the identical experience.

I know none of this is intuitive for you and others like you. But the evidence is so overwhelming that one should ignore all sighted, uncontrolled tests.
 

amirm

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Most people will buy based on sonic impression, and then take their new toy home to find out it does not sound like they wanted lol
Or the reverse. That is the problem with improper listening tests. The outcome is as good as random. It is not reliable and as such, durable over time, content, mood, etc.
 

amirm

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I think it has to do with the mindset of "unfamiliarity", which causes the imagination to set in.

That's why I believe in judging/comparing one item at a time in your system.
Nope. It has nothing to do with that. And what you are saying has been tested and shown to be false: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ity-and-reliability-of-abx-blind-testing.186/

The results were that the Long Island group [Audiophile/Take Home Group] was unable to identify the distortion in either of their tests. SMWTMS's listeners also failed the "take home" test scoring 11 correct out of 18 which fails to be significant at the 5% confidence level. However, using the A/B/X test, the SMWTMS not only proved audibility of the distortion within 45 minutes, but they went on to correctly identify a lower amount. The A/B/X test was proven to be more sensitive than long-term listening for this task.

As you see, taking the device home, listening on one's system for long period did the reverse: it reduced one's ability to tell differences, NOT more.
 

RayDunzl

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I still have the belief system that you can percieve in real world reality without doubt.

Yeah?

Try this:

The squares marked A and B are the same shade of gray.

1563307884387.png


1563308381430.png
 
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SIY

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Or watch a skilled close-up magician.
 
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