Emotiva ERC-4 CD Player (DAC) Review

[AndreaT]

As I move to FLAC files from my CD collection, CD players are becoming less important in my audio chain. However, it takes longer to turn the server on, as it counts each archived files (77,500 so far) than to place a CD in the tray and hit play. The whole process from the time I press the on button to ready to play files is about 10 min or so. If this Emotiva CD player had an impeccable measurements, it could be a back-up source. It would be useful to have more CD players tested through the digital output, as this is the configuration used when a SOTA DAC is in the music system.

 

[JayGilb]

As I move to FLAC files from my CD collection, CD players are becoming less important in my audio chain. However, it takes longer to turn the server on, as it counts each archived files (77,500 so far) than to place a CD in the tray and hit play. The whole process from the time I press the on button to ready to play files is about 10 min or so. If this Emotiva CD player had an impeccable measurements, it could be a back-up source. It would be useful to have more CD players tested through the digital output, as this is the configuration used when a SOTA DAC is in the music system.

There should be some setting in the software to not scan library contents upon startup.

 

[JeremyFife]

Interesting, but I don't think I can vote.

I understand using a CD player as a transport only (bypass the inbuilt DAC), but not the concept of using one as a DAC.
Would anyone use a CD player as their DAC/preamp?

It's a clear argument for bypassing the DAC in this model, and it's interesting and instructive as a review. Just not sure what to make of it.

 

[AndreaT]

There should be some setting in the software to not scan library contents upon startup.

Maybe. The excellent UI of the Weiss MAN301 does not seem to offer the no-scan option (I turn off the server and the SSD hard drives at the end of the day). I am open to further instructions if you happen to know!

 

[muslhead]

Another Emotiva technical wonder. Review after review seems to show their problems so poorly designed.
Yah, still bitter after my stupid error of wasting money on their XMC-2 POS so just venting
Why they are still in business (i know, they are inexpensive) I will never understand.

 

[ThatGuyYouKnow]

I rolled my eyes when I first saw their "Differential Reference" moniker. Trying to market the devices as premium products with a much less than premium performance.

 

[antcollinet]

Maybe. The excellent UI of the Weiss MAN301 does not seem to offer the no-scan option (I turn off the server and the SSD hard drives at the end of the day). I am open to further instructions if you happen to know!

I've had a quick look through the Weiss manual - but it is not detailed enough to give that level of detail of the operation. You might want to contact Weiss support to see if they can offer a solution for this.

 

[jimbones]

Great Review. thank you as you provide a valuable service to music lovers. I have a concern. I use the ERC-3 but only as a transport and output the digital into an Auralic Vega DAC, Am I getting compromised sound? Or since I am bypassing the internal DAC of the CD player am I OK?? Thanks

 

[DSJR]

I'd love to see a proper review of the Rega Saturn player. Trouble is, it's expensive enough here and all but doubles in price when sold in the US, so a non-starter I suspect. It does seem to 'sound' just fine and rather better (less constricted subjectively) than the cheaper Apollo R which has been a £600-ish mainstay for us brits still playing CD's. It may well be totally out of date today, but I've always enjoyed music played through it and never found anything wanting subjectively.

Rega Saturn MK3 CD player DAC

Rega Saturn MK3 CD player CD / DAC player Rega CDP new Saturn CD player new Rega CD player Saturn MK3 rega audio hi-fi

www.rega.co.uk

 

[Kegemusha]

I have a 12 years Yamaha CD player, I do listen to CDs now and then but I use it as a transport to a DAC by the spdif output and to an Ncore AMP, to me sounds really good.

While the DAC here performs badly, we don't know for sure how the CD to dig out ports performs (problably the same), anyway I would never buy a CD/DAC.

 

[JayGilb]

Maybe. The excellent UI of the Weiss MAN301 does not seem to offer the no-scan option (I turn off the server and the SSD hard drives at the end of the day). I am open to further instructions if you happen to know!

I downloaded the manual also and was unable to find a option for this feature.
Maybe leave it powered up ? The Weiss and ssd drives probably do not consume too much.

 

[Frank Sol]

FWIW--- The ERC-2 (Slot Loader) was a very good CDT

 

[Jim Shaw]

Glad to see a review of something other than the recently reviewed cables, bad center speakers, and hundred-dollar gaming monitor speakers -- even if it's not reviewed for its primary intended use as a CD player.

How far did you throw your test CD to break it in half?

 

[617]

Wish I understood what Emo was really about. They seem like they should be able to put out a competent product, but outside of people that like their Speakers and the cost of most of their product, they just don't deliver.
Personally, I was about to buy some of their Amps several years ago and reached out to ask some tech questions about the performance of the modules they used and their Tech Team couldn't answer about simple output questions. *shrugs
Oh well.

Emotiva = Can't Afford Mac

 

[Jim Shaw]

Wish I understood what Emo was really about. They seem like they should be able to put out a competent product, but outside of people that like their Speakers and the cost of most of their product, they just don't deliver.
Personally, I was about to buy some of their Amps several years ago and reached out to ask some tech questions about the performance of the modules they used and their Tech Team couldn't answer about simple output questions. *shrugs
Oh well.

I own some Emotiva analog gear, amp and preamp, and find it very serviceable, durable, and of decent quality. Communicating with the company is quick and honest. Mine cost perhaps 1/5 to 1/10th of what luxury gear might cost. In return, I feel I get a large share of the sound quality that some high-end gear might provide. Not all audiophile equipment needs to be state-of-the-art. Ask any pro user.

Many of us out here don't need SOTA gear. We don't require milled aluminum fronts, solid steel knobs, big blue meters, or 1,000 watts at a SINAD of 120 dB. Sure, a few of us are willing to step up to the high-end cash register -- but far more of us, for purchasing decisions, compare value more than near approaches to perfection.

Emotiva, amongst others, provides a value proposition for the taste of some of us. We don't think we're getting $8,000 gear for $800. Or even $2500 gear for $600. Sure, we're more likely to settle for high value rather than top shelf. Just like I listen to vinyl, old CDs, and 16/48k streams if they're a music rendition I seek. Not everything in music playback has to come in lossless 24/384k files sent to Revel Solons.

So, I say it's about value, not merely SOTA and milled front panels. And that's where I find Emotiva. If instead, your goal is top shelf, so be it. Just don't be blind to the value metric.

That said, it's fine to test and share data on performance using precision test methods. That gives us the numerator in the value equation.

Performance/cost = value. It's a way of evaluating based on needs, not SOTA.

 

[KSTR]

Pics from under the hood here: https://www.superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/emotiva-erc-4-cd-player-dac-review.12083/
The signal path doesn't look like it would generate the shown spectrum and the spurious frequencies.

Something really must have gone wrong, as an SPDIF-Receiver into AD1955 into LM4562 I/Vs and outputs should generate a nice and clean better than -110dB spectrum at 1kHz. I doubt Emotiva R&D and QC engineers would give the shown performance a pass.
LM4562 have a tendency to produce "popcorn" noise, maybe that's what we're seeing in one channel.

I can hardly accept the excuse of not having a test signal CD at hand as it takes no more than a few minutes to generate the files and burn them on CD (the player even takes data-CDs).

 

[ryanosaur]

I own some Emotiva analog gear, amp and preamp, and find it very serviceable, durable, and of decent quality. Communicating with the company is quick and honest. Mine cost perhaps 1/5 to 1/10th of what luxury gear might cost. In return, I feel I get a large share of the sound quality that some high-end gear might provide. Not all audiophile equipment needs to be state-of-the-art. Ask any pro user.

Many of us out here don't need SOTA gear. We don't require milled aluminum fronts, solid steel knobs, big blue meters, or 1,000 watts at a SINAD of 120 dB. Sure, a few of us are willing to step up to the high-end cash register -- but far more of us, for purchasing decisions, compare value more than near approaches to perfection.

Emotiva, amongst others, provides a value proposition for the taste of some of us. We don't think we're getting $8,000 gear for $800. Or even $2500 gear for $600. Sure, we're more likely to settle for high value rather than top shelf. Just like I listen to vinyl, old CDs, and 16/48k streams if they're a music rendition I seek. Not everything in music playback has to come in lossless 24/384k files sent to Revel Solons.

So, I say it's about value, not merely SOTA and milled front panels. And that's where I find Emotiva. If instead, your goal is top shelf, so be it. Just don't be blind to the value metric.

That said, it's fine to test and share data on performance using precision test methods. That gives us the numerator in the value equation.

Performance/cost = value. It's a way of evaluating based on needs, not SOTA.


View attachment 270987View attachment 270990

I get this perspective and is why I was drawn in originally. I looked long and hard at them as a solution for some of my needs.

However, when I asked about some of the performance metrics of their Stereo Amp Modules in relation to the very detailed info available for the MonoBlade modules, I was sorely disappointed that they couldn't or wouldn't give any information.
Of course, not too long after this, we started seeing the disappointing performance of their flagship AVP.

I was glad at that point I didn't join their ecosystem.

Instead, I purchased 5 Outlaw 2200 Amps during their Black Friday sale and added two X-13 Subs when the X-mas sale hit... both orders included delivery in the sale price.

Clearly, my focus wasn't on SOTA, rather value. And working value on that.

I've seen more complaints about the various AVPs that Emo has pushed out to market than just about anything else I've looked at. And I get that they all have problems (not just Emo). But how seriously am I supposed to take a company that can't or won't fulfill their promise on a single product like their flagship AVP... for years! ...while pushing out other similar product that still garner more complaints than kudos?

To be fair, their Amps are very serviceable by all accounts. IIRC, James Larson uses one of the BasX Amps in his testing rig. Cool. No complaints.

Yet there are also the stories of folk that had product from them, including Amps, that had a short product life cycle and couldn't be serviced after that cycle was changed/ended by Emo.

What I see from them is a company with an ADHD attitude toward their product stable and a certain level of incompetence when it comes to delivering on a level of trust necessary for garnering an investment of several thousand dollars for any of their equipment. To me they are very much defined by the phrase "Buyer Beware" based on my own experience with them.

I want them to be a better company worthy of my hard earned money. That's all.

 

[Jim Shaw]

I get this perspective and is why I was drawn in originally. I looked long and hard at them as a solution for some of my needs.

However, when I asked about some of the performance metrics of their Stereo Amp Modules in relation to the very detailed info available for the MonoBlade modules, I was sorely disappointed that they couldn't or wouldn't give any information.
Of course, not too long after this, we started seeing the disappointing performance of their flagship AVP.

I was glad at that point I didn't join their ecosystem.

Instead, I purchased 5 Outlaw 2200 Amps during their Black Friday sale and added two X-13 Subs when the X-mas sale hit... both orders included delivery in the sale price.

Clearly, my focus wasn't on SOTA, rather value. And working value on that.

I've seen more complaints about the various AVPs that Emo has pushed out to market than just about anything else I've looked at. And I get that they all have problems (not just Emo). But how seriously am I supposed to take a company that can't or won't fulfill their promise on a single product like their flagship AVP... for years! ...while pushing out other similar product that still garner more complaints than kudos?

To be fair, their Amps are very serviceable by all accounts. IIRC, James Larson uses one of the BasX Amps in his testing rig. Cool. No complaints.

Yet there are also the stories of folk that had product from them, including Amps, that had a short product life cycle and couldn't be serviced after that cycle was changed/ended by Emo.

What I see from them is a company with an ADHD attitude toward their product stable and a certain level of incompetence when it comes to delivering on a level of trust necessary for garnering an investment of several thousand dollars for any of their equipment. To me they are very much defined by the phrase "Buyer Beware" based on my own experience with them.

I want them to be a better company worthy of my hard earned money. That's all.

Appreciate the reply. Yes, I have only used Emotiva analog stuff -- four maybe five years, 24 hours a day on-cycle. It soldiers on and sounds quite good.

Their speakers are well reviewed for performance vs. cost. I don't own those / can't comment. Their decoders seem to draw few accolades, as do many others'.

If I had reason to purchase new amps, they might well be of the new NCore or Purfi modules. Either would be objectively better and fairly priced by integrators. Meanwhile, my Emotiva gear gives me no reason to change. They owe me nothing but a pat on the top cover.

 

[amirm]

To my knowledge there is no sort of standard for consumer devices that says balanced output level shall be 2x unbalanced output level.

So there is a standard for outputting 2.1 volt??? I have tested probably 100+ balanced DACs that output 4 volt. I call that a standard. De-facto standard. And input version of those devices expect 4 volts on XLR input, not 2.1. So I am going to advocate 4 volts nominal.

 

[amirm]

Something really must have gone wrong, as an SPDIF-Receiver into AD1955 into LM4562 I/Vs and outputs should generate a nice and clean better than -110dB spectrum at 1kHz. I doubt Emotiva R&D and QC engineers would give the shown performance a pass.
LM4562 have a tendency to produce "popcorn" noise, maybe that's what we're seeing in one channel.

I can hardly accept the excuse of not having a test signal CD at hand as it takes no more than a few minutes to generate the files and burn them on CD (the player even takes data-CDs).

Assuming company spec follows your argument that it is from CD, this is what they spec:

And this is what I got:

0.00195 in good channel versus 0.00150. Definitely in the same neighborhood.

The original request from member was to test the DAC and that is what I signed up to do. At the end, when I saw these results, I did think about spinning my test CD but found it broken as I reported. I only have one old computer left with CD drive. Not only do I have to create the tracks and burn them there, then I have to mess with AP software to measure in asych mode which is a pain to do. So I ran with what the member requested.

From past experience, these results only get worse anyway when you switch to 24 bit to 16 bit as the latter limits you to 93 dB SINAD.