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HDMI, coax or optical cable - is one more suitable for a long (approx 15 metres) run?

Joffy1780

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Hi guys, looking for a little advice please. I'm planning on adding a DAC+headphone amp in my living room for late night TV and music listening.
For TV/movies the idea is to use the zone 2 hdmi output of my AVR (Denon 3600) connected to an HDMI extractor, then coax or optical out to the DAC.
The DAC will be sat behind my sofa and will need a cable of about 15 metres to connect to the AVR.
Would I better to have the HDMI extractor behind the sofa and a really short run to the DAC or a short run to the HDMI extractor and a long run for the optical/coax? Or does it not matter either way?
I was originally going to use Bluetooth for the TV/movies but these extractors are so cheap I'd prefer the stability and (hopefully) better performance via optical/coax.
DAC+amp is likely to be either a Topping dx3 pro + or an S.M.S.L. C200 and headphones likely AKG-371, not looking to spend a fortune.
Any help appreciated.
 

rationaltime

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Hello,

While it would probably work either way, in general best practice
for signal integrity is to route the high speed signals as little
as possible. Process or extract the information you need close to
the source. Then route the extracted lower speed signals to where
you need them. In other words put the HDMI extractor close to the
source with short cables. Route the digital audio signals the longer
distance to the DAC.

Though it should work with either electrical or optical cable,
I would choose optical interconnect.

Thanks,
rationaltime
 

jasonhanjk

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AKG-371 will have higher crosstalk compare to other normal hp, I would say don't spend too much money getting good gear.
I would recommend coax.
 

JSmith

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Would I better to have the HDMI extractor behind the sofa and a really short run to the DAC or a short run to the HDMI extractor and a long run for the optical/coax? Or does it not matter either way?
You're more likely to run into problems with a 15m HDMI than optical (and that assumes no 4K... if so, 3m), unless the HDMI is powered/active/optical. 15m is at the edge for some optical/spdif, but should be fine up to 15m if not longer.


JSmith
 

Rja4000

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In theory, I'd use an audio extractor at the source, then run the audio digital signal on a balanced cable (AES/EBU).

In practice, it will probably be cheaper to use SPDIF. You may find good quality 15m optical cable, like this one, but that's at the max range limit.

If needed, you could add an SPDIF to Cat6 extender (around 100€), and have the long run done with a network cable. Cat 6 cables are strictly certified for performances, so bad surprises are less likely, and this will be a balanced connection for the long run.
 

Mnyb

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I think coax is better for a long run . toslink is really meant only for relative short distances ? afaik .

or get wireless headphones with a base unit directly coupled to the AVR :) that's what my dad uses for late night movies when mom's asleep
 

voodooless

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HDMI over long distances brings you inevitably to an active cable, meaning it’s high speed data is transferred via optical with active converters on both ends. Those cables can work extremely well, but are quite expensive. Toslink works up to 5 to 10 meters, but there may be more advanced cables that do better with appropriate costs. So as others have said, coaxial would be the best bet for such a distance. And it’s also the cheapest option :)
 
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Joffy1780

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Thanks very much, guys.
So definitely HDMI extractor close to the source.
Seems to be a couple of votes each for coax and optical, but I'm leaning towards optical.
 

voodooless

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Seems to be a couple of votes each for coax and optical, but I'm leaning towards optical.
Why? The design spec for optical is 10m maximum, while coaxial is speced to 10 to 15 meters. You may extend the 10m by using real glass cables, but those are a lot more expensive.
 
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Joffy1780

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Why? The design spec for optical is 10m maximum, while coaxial is speced to 10 to 15 meters. You may extend the 10m by using real glass cables, but those are a lot more expensive.
I'm now leaning toward coaxial.
 

Rja4000

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I'm now leaning toward coaxial.
Then go for a real cable


Or any other serious 75 ohm coax flexible cable.

(If BNC, you'll have to add the BNC to RCA adapters)

I still think the Cat6 way is better and more flexible
 
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Joffy1780

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Then go for a real cable


Or any other serious 75 ohm coax flexible cable.

(If BNC, you'll have to add the BNC to RCA adapters)

I still think the Cat6 way is better and more flexible
Thanks. I'll be looking to get a decent 75 ohm coax with RCA if possible.
Regards Cat6, although €100 doesn't seem a great deal, it is near enough adding an extra 30% to the total cost, so not really worth it unless I come across major issues.
 

jasonhanjk

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You may compare to other HP, their star ground connection is at the 3.5mm stereo jack. Which makes the weak link only at the 3.5mm jack.

Whereas this AKG HP ground starts at the beginning of the cable from the driver all the way to the 3.5mm jack. The LR contamination can be spotted at the 3 pole at the HP, along the cable and the 3.5mm jack.

I am the source since I have an AP and years of audio measurement experience. You may repeat the same measurement at your side if you have proper setup.
 

staticV3

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I am the source since I have an AP and years of audio measurement experience. You may repeat the same measurement at your side if you have proper setup.
If you have actual measurements of the K371's crosstalk compared to other headphones, then please do share those!
 

jasonhanjk

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If you have actual measurements of the K371's crosstalk compared to other headphones, then please do share those!
Please send me one then I'll break open to measure. There will also be fees for such request.
 

BJL

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Would I better to have the HDMI extractor behind the sofa and a really short run to the DAC or a short run to the HDMI extractor and a long run for the optical/coax? Or does it not matter either way?
I have had great success with a 40 foot run of fiber optic (Toslink) cable, this is to connect my phono pre (a Puffin) to the optical input of an AVR. The reason I do this is because I had to put the turntable in a place inaccessible to my cats. They love sitting on top of turntables.

I use very inexpensive plastic cable, I believe that I bought them from Monoprice. I do not believe that there is any advantage whatsoever to expensive Toslink cables, be they glass or plastic.
 

Chrise36

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Hi guys, looking for a little advice please. I'm planning on adding a DAC+headphone amp in my living room for late night TV and music listening.
For TV/movies the idea is to use the zone 2 hdmi output of my AVR (Denon 3600) connected to an HDMI extractor, then coax or optical out to the DAC.
The DAC will be sat behind my sofa and will need a cable of about 15 metres to connect to the AVR.
Would I better to have the HDMI extractor behind the sofa and a really short run to the DAC or a short run to the HDMI extractor and a long run for the optical/coax? Or does it not matter either way?
I was originally going to use Bluetooth for the TV/movies but these extractors are so cheap I'd prefer the stability and (hopefully) better performance via optical/coax.
DAC+amp is likely to be either a Topping dx3 pro + or an S.M.S.L. C200 and headphones likely AKG-371, not looking to spend a fortune.
Any help appreciated.
If possible use a fairly long ( 5m) good hdmi cable to the extractor and from there use optical as some dacs have problems with coaxial inputs.
 
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Joffy1780

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You may compare to other HP, their star ground connection is at the 3.5mm stereo jack. Which makes the weak link only at the 3.5mm jack.

Whereas this AKG HP ground starts at the beginning of the cable from the driver all the way to the 3.5mm jack. The LR contamination can be spotted at the 3 pole at the HP, along the cable and the 3.5mm jack.

I am the source since I have an AP and years of audio measurement experience. You may repeat the same measurement at your side if you have proper setup.
Would the same apply to all headphones with a detachable cord, or is it an issue with these 'phones in particular?
 
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