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TRUTHEAR x Crinacle Zero IEM Review

Rate this IEM

  • 1. Poor (headless panther)

    Votes: 13 2.2%
  • 2. Not terrible (postman panther)

    Votes: 21 3.5%
  • 3. Fine (happy panther)

    Votes: 73 12.2%
  • 4. Great (golfing panther)

    Votes: 493 82.2%

  • Total voters
    600

Robbo99999

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I know they don't. I have different IEMs from Shure, Moondrop, Samsung, JVC, Massdrop, Pinnacle and others. Also headphones from Sennheiser and HiFiman and Koss. They can all be eq'd to offer the same frequency response very easily these days on PC or mobile. They absolutely do not sound the same even when EQ matched. Similar(ish), yes, but a long way from identical. All these publicly available correction curves like at AutoEQ are great for correcting gross errors but in fact you can't make them all sound the same. It's also worth remembering that almost all IEM measurements over 8000Hz are known to be unreliable, so using them in a parametric EQ correction doesn't make much sense. And anyway most EQ corrections require really significant precut, -7 and -8 dB is not unusual; how many phones can really lose even 3 or 4 dB and still have great sound? Very few.
Part of the reason for why they might not sound the same are unit to unit variation invalidating the accuracy of your EQ's - ie you can't be sure that each IEM you own is EQ'd to the exact same curve - so in that instance you can still explain your perceived sound differences due to differing frequency responses. The second one is the IEM's may not fit in your ear in the same ways thereby creating some different interactions that again change the frequency response you perceive - although I'd think this phenomenon is less than the same phenomenon with over ear headphones. The third reason is that you might not have level matched your IEM's between swapping them to compare - louder sounds better / also affects tonality. Fourth reason is that it's just hard to compare headphones/speakers/IEM's - it takes time to swap them over at which point you've forgotton some of the finer nuances of how the previous one sounded - as detailed remembering of how something sounds only really lasts a few seconds.......that doesn't mean you shouldn't try to compare your IEM's headphones/etc, just that it's not easy.

However, if you take two identical models of headphones and you actually measure those units and EQ them to same curve throughout the frequency range then they will sound the same - I know that because I've got more than one unit of the same headphone, measured them all on my miniDSP EARS and did an experiment once to EQ a few of those units to the exact same curve - they did sound the same, but that's because you're completely removing the unit to unit variation and it's the same model of headphone - so frequency response doesn't lie - just you don't always know what that is.
 

Robbo99999

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I just purchased a pair on Amazon. It will be interesting to be able to listen to one of the items reviewed on ASR finally. Even more interesting will be, judging by the number of people buying these IEMs, there will be a common reference for a lot of people when comparing to other headphones etc..
Yeah, good point!
 

Robbo99999

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Amir said bass distortion crept up easily.
Well, the bass measurements are good:
index.php

I think you could get away with a +5dB peak filter at 20Hz as long as you're not listening at extreme levels. From measuring my listening levels of my own headphones on my miniDSP EARS then I know the red line is the only one I need to consider at worse case even when adding a +5dB boost to the bass.
 

Robbo99999

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Think I'll stick with my $5 Sony MH755 (with or without EQ). You don't want to skimp on sub-bass with IEMs as they provide zero tactile bass. Bonus: no pedopackaging.
Nope. The MH755's THD is just as good (even better in the sub-bass if you were to EQ the Truthear up to Harman):

index.php


index.php


With low IMD too:

index.php


index.php


(Measurements by @Earfonia )
Ha, not bad for $5! Distortion is very similar, but as you say you have more bass with the Sony. Stock frequency response is more accurate with the Truthear X Crinacle though.
 

PeteL

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However, if you take two identical models of headphones and you actually measure those units and EQ them to same curve throughout the frequency range then they will sound the same - I know that because I've got more than one unit of the same headphone, measured them all on my miniDSP EARS and did an experiment once to EQ a few of those units to the exact same curve - they did sound the same, but that's because you're completely removing the unit to unit variation and it's the same model of headphone - so frequency response doesn't lie - just you don't always know what that is.
What do you mean? If it's the same model, it has the same physical and electrical characteristics and the same drivers, of course if if you apply the same EQ it will sound the same. Unit to unit variations is tiny to negligible, but I don't think it's what is being debated. It doesn't only have the same frequency response, everything is the same.
 

jae

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Better to precise it, indeed ! But anyway your initial statement was a source of confusion.
When we listen to music (or to any sounds in general) we don't artificially distinguish "tonality" and "total perception".
Every sound parameter is in relation with each other, the whole being integrated by our brain to form a global perception.

As for me, it's impossible to assume that a headphone's sound is "like the best speaker in best room with no room modes", just because there is no room at all, obviously ! Consequently, the global perception, including tonality, can't be felt the same for a headphone, as good as it is, and a speaker, as good as it is too..
I guess it all depends how one define "tonality". When some people say tonality, I can only assume are referring to the "frequency" component of timbre or at least what an overall "tuning" (bass/mids/highs/whatever) sounds like and how it's balanced relatively in different bands compared to the benchmark (the speaker in a room). If someone is using tonality to refer to overall timbre as a whole, then there lies a problem because the room and physiological interaction are not insignificant components of timbre, as they impart characteristics to the reproduced sound in a very non-linear fashion in frequency and also temporally. Headphones in general ignore much of that, and IEMs even further. Changes to a response can "restore" or give the illusion of a more accurate timbre in lieu of using headphones (for example, the not-so-intuitive bass boost), whereas you need to rely on the content of the music or some fancy individualised DSP to go beyond these limits if the goal is to work on matching "total perception".
 

charleski

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Can I ask please, what should I look for in my Quad Artera peamp spec. to find the sensitivity requirements for these iem,s?
It does say, " headphone out, 6.35 mm". And nothing else, that I can see.
The headphone out in most integrated amps is really just an afterthought. The only measurement available is from Stereophile: "With the volume control set to its maximum ("90"), a 1kHz tone at –20dBFS resulted in output levels of 250mV (balanced preamplifier output), 266mV (headphone output), and 3.63V (speaker output)." This will have been measured with it driving a high-impedance load so says little about the ability to deliver current, but that usually isn't an issue with iems. It does suggest that the unit's headphone out can swing more than enough voltage to drive these.
 

DavidEdwinAston

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The headphone out in most integrated amps is really just an afterthought. The only measurement available is from Stereophile: "With the volume control set to its maximum ("90"), a 1kHz tone at –20dBFS resulted in output levels of 250mV (balanced preamplifier output), 266mV (headphone output), and 3.63V (speaker output)." This will have been measured with it driving a high-impedance load so says little about the ability to deliver current, but that usually isn't an issue with iems. It does suggest that the unit's headphone out can swing more than enough voltage to drive these.
Thank you very much charleski. :)
 

Robbo99999

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What do you mean? If it's the same model, it has the same physical and electrical characteristics and the same drivers, of course if if you apply the same EQ it will sound the same. Unit to unit variations is tiny to negligible, but I don't think it's what is being debated. It doesn't only have the same frequency response, everything is the same.
Unit to unit variation is not tiny nor negligable, but it depends on what model of headphone you're talking about - that's the main point I'm making, and that frequency response is the most important determinant. I also made the point about different models of headphone/IEM having different interactions with anatomy that can ultimately change frequency response. (I'd appreciate if you didn't just choose one part of my post to quote, instead of the whole, as the whole has the overall meaning and you misrepresent my point by quoting only part of it).
 

BDWoody

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It's been known for a while that (at least the wired) apple earbuds were designed with materials specifically designed to fail after regular use after a certain period of time (don't remember the specifics, but it was in the 1 or 2 year range).

Can you provide more info on this statement please?
 

AndreaT

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Better to precise it, indeed ! But anyway your initial statement was a source of confusion.
When we listen to music (or to any sounds in general) we don't artificially distinguish "tonality" and "total perception".
Every sound parameter is in relation with each other, the whole being integrated by our brain to form a global perception.

As for me, it's impossible to assume that a headphone's sound is "like the best speaker in best room with no room modes", just because there is no room at all, obviously ! Consequently, the global perception, including tonality, can't be felt the same for a headphone, as good as it is, and a speaker, as good as it is too..
Sound perception evolved without IEM and relies on integration between cochlear and vestibular signals. IEM and HP in general do not modify our sound perception as we move our heads, while speaker sound in the air around us does. I distinctly remember my slight nausea and slight ataxia (impaired coordination) the first time I listened to the original Walkman while walking in a meadow, circa 1980.
 

PeteL

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Unit to unit variation is not tiny nor negligable, but it depends on what model of headphone you're talking about - that's the main point I'm making, and that frequency response is the most important determinant. I also made the point about different models of headphone/IEM having different interactions with anatomy that can ultimately change frequency response. (I'd appreciate if you didn't just choose one part of my post to quote, instead of the whole, as the whole has the overall meaning and you misrepresent my point by quoting only part of it).
OK but the original comment was not about unit to unit variation he was saying he had many different models of headphones, not many headphones of the same model, for the rest of your statement yes I agree that Louder usually sounds better and that different earphones will not necessarily interact the same way on a measurement rig that in your ears, I have nothing to debate on this part. But none of that demonstrate that 2 different earphones EQ'd to match the same tonality will sound exactly the same. I also have the miniDSP EARS. Great product.
 

Robbo99999

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OK but the original comment was not about unit to unit variation he was saying he had many different models of headphones, not many headphones of the same model, for the rest of your statement yes I agree that Louder usually sounds better and that different earphones will not necessarily interact the same way on a measurement rig that in your ears, I have nothing to debate on this part. But none of that demonstrate that 2 different earphones EQ'd to match the same tonality will sound exactly the same. I also have the miniDSP EARS. Great product.
Yes, but I was expanding on the point of unit to unit variation, my different units of same headphone do not sound exactly the same, but they do after each one has been measured and EQ'd to the same curve.

I actually never said that two different headphone models EQ'd to the same curve would sound the same - in fact I said the opposite, that it's possible that they won't, due to different models of headphone/IEM having different interactions with anatomy that can ultimately change frequency response (as well as the inherent unit to unit variation variable of that headphone model), which I've said three times now (once in this post, and twice in the previous two posts.)
 

kaopad999

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Thank you for the review. They seem nice, and could be worth a try for 50 USD!
the Honest Audiophile reviewer thought they were too bright and agressive which does seem to be an issue with a lot of Chinese headphones and IEM's i've heard.
has anyone else here heard these IEMS?
 

RHO

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YNpOpOn.png


And now we have the ability to compare measurement rigs! Not versed in the finer details of the different types of dB scales, just curious if anyone can help me understand the differences between Amir's and Crinacle's measurements in the above image (Crins' measurements in faded blue/red). I've tried to adjust the images so that their axes match. The 'zero line' is aligned at 95dB of both images.

*Used Crin's 'sample 10' image for the comparison
Crin's is normalized to his target curve and Amir's is the raw measurement compared to Harman IE. That's why you see the big difference between 1kHz and 10Khz.
 

Atratusnex

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Seems like they have unfortunate QC problems, with driver mismatch- channel imbalance- especially in the bass. This isn't displayed in the measurements here, but buyers should be aware. You might not get this bass, not one both sides. look here:
 

GaryH

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Stock frequency response is more accurate with the Truthear X Crinacle though.
Yeah, I mostly use EQ though so that cancels that advantage. Also, it matters where the response is more accurate. For example, the Truthear is a bit over target bettween 1 and ~3 kHz, which can make for a somewhat 'shouty' sound, and can be particularly bothersome compared to inaccuracies in other parts of the frequency response. And this shoutiness is just what @Resolve heard with them, likely also exacerbated by the slight lack of energy between 125 and ~225 Hz ('warmth'), and possibly the lacking sub-bass too:

 
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