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GR Research LGK 2.0 Speaker Review (A Joke)

Rate this speaker:

  • 1. Poor (headless panther)

    Votes: 367 87.8%
  • 2. Not terrible (postman panther)

    Votes: 35 8.4%
  • 3. Fine (happy panther

    Votes: 7 1.7%
  • 4. Great (golfing panther)

    Votes: 9 2.2%

  • Total voters
    418

Rick Sykora

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As I said previously, if I were to try and build a speaker system with a driver that handled the entire frequency range (obviating the need for a crossover), I would try and put as many of them together in parallel as I could in the same box, but taking into account the impedance issues involved when wiring speakers in parallel.

Ok, but this thread is about the LGK 2.0...

If you want to talk about how you might design something different, please consider starting your own thread. Btw, if you want to start adding drivers to a vented enclosure, know that you will need a bigger box. In the simple case, adding one more driver, typically means doubling the cabinet volume.
 

restorer-john

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Regardless of the problems of the LGK 2.0, I don't put that product in the same category as the snake-oil products.

It is marketed as a 'little giant killer'* loudspeaker and sold for a not-inconsiderable amount of money, for which you could obtain numerous better (and cheaper) speakers. That firmly puts the product into the snake-oil category.

*In other words: outperforming speakers at multiple times its price.
 

YSC

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When did I ever question your ethics or make up facts?

What I did question is 47 pages of comments (not by you, but by others) attacking the LGK 2.0 as if it is ruining the audio industry and is a complete fraud by GR-Research and it's owner (I forgot the guys name). Yes, the LGK has a lot of problems, especially when expected to be a used at realistic listening levels, but it is not snake-oil.

I do agree, however, that GR-Research is damaging the audio industry (or more accurately damaging consumers) with products like cable lifters and other snake-oil products. However, the audio industry was already ruined by dozens of other companies and YouTube reviewers who have pushed that kind of crap (including outrageously expensive cables and audio ethernet switches) long before GR-Research. Regardless of the problems of the LGK 2.0, I don't put that product in the same category as the snake-oil products.
When a product is marketed way above what it does, and even have a defensive video saying it’s perfect and no miss, yet selling for considerable price, it is snake oil.

In a sense ultra thick fancy cables with direction arrows works perfectly in their real job, just costing thousands
 

Mark_A

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Ok, but this thread is about the LGK 2.0...

If you want to talk about how you might design something different, please consider starting your own thread. Btw, if you want to start adding drivers to a vented enclosure, know that you will need a bigger box. In the simple case, adding one more driver, typically means doubling the cabinet volume.
The LGK 2.0 is sold as a bare driver, driver plus electronics/connectors, and as a completed and fully finished speaker system. The speaker box can also be purchased separately. So I didn't know that a discussion of the LGK 2.0 bare driver was off-topic, especially since I was responding to your post regarding the using the LGK 2.0 speaker box with a different driver.

Yes, I am very much aware of considerations regarding the box size and the driver (or drivers) in a ported design (or even in an sealed enclosure), especially for optimum bass performance. But I can't respond to that without apparently being off-topic, so I will pass.
 

Doodski

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The LGK 2.0 is sold as a bare driver, driver plus electronics/connectors, and as a completed and fully finished speaker system. The speaker box can also be purchased separately. So I didn't know that a discussion of the LGK 2.0 bare driver was off-topic, especially since I was responding to your post regarding the using the LGK 2.0 speaker box with a different driver.

Yes, I am very much aware of considerations regarding the box size and the driver (or drivers) in a ported design (or even in an sealed enclosure), especially for optimum bass performance. But I can't respond to that without apparently being off-topic, so I will pass.
I apologize for being snarky towards you yesterday. I was working on ~<5 hours of sleep and I was dozing at my PC all day and was grumpy. I'm not usually that way and it was out of character for me.
 

Rick Sykora

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The LGK 2.0 is sold as a bare driver, driver plus electronics/connectors, and as a completed and fully finished speaker system. The speaker box can also be purchased separately. So I didn't know that a discussion of the LGK 2.0 bare driver was off-topic, especially since I was responding to your post regarding the using the LGK 2.0 speaker box with a different driver.

Yes, I am very much aware of considerations regarding the box size and the driver (or drivers) in a ported design (or even in an sealed enclosure), especially for optimum bass performance. But I can't respond to that without apparently being off-topic, so I will pass.

Suggest you spend a bit more time reading more on ASR and this thread and get a handle on how ASR operates. If you had done so on this thread, you would know that have a LGK2 cabinet because I acquired and built the speaker for Amir to test. He only listens to one, so I have the spare parts. If you want to know more, see my build thread that he references in the initial post.

Am not here to endorse or defend Danny except on facts. Not only did he not publish all the LGK driver parameters originally, as I mentioned earlier, he lowered Xmax significantly. This occurred right around the same time as Amir's review. Since you apparently know speaker design, you can draw own conclusions. Just in case you had not seen, here is my exchange with Danny from earlier this year...

1657823160501.png


If you check the GR website, here are the params now:

Sd: 30.78 sq. cm
Diameter: 62.61 mm
X-Max 1 mm
Max peak power full range: 30 watts.
Max peak power with first two octaves removed: 60 watts

Xmax has been lowered and, in case you missed, he added a conditional power rating (that as not posted originally either). In any case, both through Amir's testing and Bassbox Pro modeling, we have shown that the driver is not able to handle anything close to 30 watts.
 
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voodooless

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Xmax has been lowered and
That bastard! That basically confirms everything. 1mm would give it about 78 dB at 100 Hz (with probably somewhere around 10% THD), and 90 dB at 200 Hz. That's roughly what Amir's graph shows (it gains a bit around 100Hz due to the BR).
 

More Dynamics Please

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The failure of any speaker to measure up to marketing claims is guaranteed to generate some level of negative comments with the degree of negativism related to the historical credibility of the speaker's source. Dogged defense of any such underperforming speaker is only going to generate escalating negative comments as might be expected. No surprises here at all.
 

tomtoo

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As I said previously, if I were to try and build a speaker system with a driver that handled the entire frequency range (obviating the need for a crossover), I would try and put as many of them together in parallel as I could in the same box, but taking into account the impedance issues involved when wiring speakers in parallel.

Maybe you learn at least a littel about speakers? Than you would learn what
problems with solutions like this come up.
 

Mark_A

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Suggest you spend a bit more time reading more on ASR and this thread and get a handle on how ASR operates. If you had done so on this thread, you would know that have a LGK2 cabinet because I acquired and built the speaker for Amir to test. He only listens to one, so I have the spare parts. If you want to know more, see my build thread that he references in the initial post.

Am not here to endorse or defend Danny except on facts. Not only did he not publish all the LGK driver parameters originally, as I mentioned earlier, he lowered Xmax significantly. This occurred right around the same time as Amir's review. Since you apparently know speaker design, you can draw own conclusions. Just in case you had not seen, here is my exchange with Danny from earlier this year...

View attachment 218292

If you check the GR website, here are the params now:

Sd: 30.78 sq. cm
Diameter: 62.61 mm
X-Max 1 mm
Max peak power full range: 30 watts.
Max peak power with first two octaves removed: 60 watts

Xmax has been lowered and, in case you missed, he added a conditional power rating (that as not posted originally either). In any case, both through Amir's testing and Bassbox Pro modeling, we have shown that the driver is not able to handle anything close to 30 watts.
I don't understand why the circumstances surrounding who built the test unit has anything to do with what I said. I am not, nor have I ever, defended the the LGK 2.0. There is no way I would consider a speaker system with a single 3" full range driver. I did, however, suggest that using multiple identical 3" drivers (as many as feasible) without any crossover, might perform at an decent level of performance. That might be true for the LGK 2,0 driver, or some other similar driver. But that is speculation on my part, and I could not say for certain without trying it out.
 

Mark_A

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Maybe you learn at least a littel about speakers? Than you would learn what
problems with solutions like this come up.
I don't understand your comments. What solutions are you talking about? If you are saying that I didn't know that cabinet volume should be matched to the bass driver to obtain maximum performance, that is not correct, because I do know that. There are ways around that problem if turned out to be audibly objectional such as changing the port size, plugging the port, or using an external subwoofers. I have listened to some great speakers that had no baffles for midrange or tweeters, but obviously some other solution might have to be done to address the lower bass.

It wasn't my idea to build a speaker system with a single full range 3" driver, and I find that concept to be far-fetched, and not surprised it didn't work.
 
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Mark_A

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The failure of any speaker to measure up to marketing claims is guaranteed to generate some level of negative comments with the degree of negativism related to the historical credibility of the speaker's source. Dogged defense of any such underperforming speaker is only going to generate escalating negative comments as might be expected. No surprises here at all.
Are you claiming that I defended the LGK 2.0 speaker system? That is categorically untrue.

I think a speaker system with a single full-range 3" driver (regardless of driver manufacturer) would be very unlikely to succeed. I did speculate that the LGK 2.0 bare driver might work in a system with multiple identical drivers (without crossover), but of course the success or failure of that would have to verified by testing it.
 

Mr. E. Guy

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It wasn't my idea to build a speaker system with a single full range 3" driver, and I find that concept to be far-fetched, and not surprised it didn't work.

I wonder how Danny's silly speakers would fare against a pair of Creative T60 that cost $70 and are active speakers, with a built-in DAC. They have 2.75" full-range drivers, so almost the same.

 

Mark_A

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I wonder how Danny's silly speakers would fare against a pair of Creative T60 that cost $70 and are active speakers, with a built-in DAC. They have 2.75" full-range drivers, so almost the same.

I have no idea. I am not really interested in bottom fishing to find the smallest, cheapest speakers for music. I would go with headphones instead.
 

Rick Sykora

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I don't understand your comments. What solutions are you talking about? If you are saying that I didn't know that cabinet volume should be matched to the bass driver to obtain maximum performance, that is not correct, because I do know that. There are ways around that problem if turned out to be audibly objectional such as changing the port size, plugging the port, or using an external subwoofers. I have listened to some great speakers that had no baffles for midrange or tweeters, but obviously some other solution might have to be done to address the lower bass.

It wasn't my idea to build a speaker system with a single full range 3" driver, and I find that concept to be far-fetched, and not surprised it didn't work.

Thanks for your clarifications and will try to ensure you are given more context next time.
 

tomtoo

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I don't understand your comments. What solutions are you talking about? If you are saying that I didn't know that cabinet volume should be matched to the bass driver to obtain maximum performance, that is not correct, because I do know that. There are ways around that problem if turned out to be audibly objectional such as changing the port size, plugging the port, or using an external subwoofers. I have listened to some great speakers that had no baffles for midrange or tweeters, but obviously some other solution might have to be done to address the lower bass.

It wasn't my idea to build a speaker system with a single full range 3" driver, and I find that concept to be far-fetched, and not surprised it didn't work.

",..,,As I said previously, if I were to try and build a speaker system with a driver that handled the entire frequency range (obviating the need for a crossover), I would try and put as many of them together in parallel as I could in the same box, but ,....."

Dont you know what you write?
 

Mark_A

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",..,,As I said previously, if I were to try and build a speaker system with a driver that handled the entire frequency range (obviating the need for a crossover), I would try and put as many of them together in parallel as I could in the same box, but ,....."

Dont you know what you write?
I don't understand what your comment is complaining about. Is there some problem or inconsistency in what I said? Please clearly and explicitly explain what your concern is.
 

tomtoo

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I don't understand what your comment is complaining about. Is there some problem or inconsistency in what I said? Please clearly and explicitly explain what your concern is.

You can not just add another fullband. It changes overall FR thru comp filtering and directivity.
 
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