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How did software development become so hard (Windows)???

TBone

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I have been going through hell ...
Back to Adobe, why not ask me if I want all these stupid services?
Had the same issue with Adobe on a HP (crap motherboards, Lenovo's r much better at handling above situation) notebook many many years ago. It nearly fried. Be very careful when dl/updating adobe in particular, to check off, or defeat services....

ended up working for HP ...
 

ElNino

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Had the same issue with Adobe on a HP (crap motherboards, Lenovo's r much better at handling above situation) notebook many many years ago. It nearly fried. Be very careful when dl/updating adobe in particular, to check off, or defeat services....

ended up working for HP ...

I actually run the only Adobe software I still use (Acrobat Professional) in a virtual machine, simply to avoid it cluttering up my computer with all the Adobe creative cloud junk and the incessant updater prompts. It's just sad that it's come to this.
 

TBone

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I actually run the only Adobe software I still use (Acrobat Professional) in a virtual machine, simply to avoid it cluttering up my computer with all the Adobe creative cloud junk and the incessant updater prompts. It's just sad that it's come to this.
Yeah, tho ive had a few processing/heat realated issues when running legacy databases on (Win10) VM lenovo thinkpad lately, hopefully since fixed ...
 

Chromatischism

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TeamViewer is an alternative for file exchange (etc.) but it ain't no poster-boy for remote connectivity w/o having to fork out for a $ub$cription
I take it you're using it commercially? I've been using it for free for over 10 years, including using the Android app to access my PC. Don't know what I'd do without it.
 

H-713

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I've been really tired of Microsoft's games for years now. I've also been pretty tired of Apple's games for a few years. Both companies (but MS is worse) have this really, really aggravating habit of coming up with this idea that is, in their mind, 'the greatest thing ever', and forcing it down their users throats at all costs, no matter what it breaks.

I really wish Linux would see a bit wider adoption. Of the three operating systems, it's by far the most pleasant to use. MacOS (whatever version they're on) is next in line, with Windows (and MS in general) making me scream on a semi-regular basis.

But... some of us got suckered into using SolidWorks (and being assaulted by Dassault Systems). So for now, Windows it is.
 

0bs3rv3r

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I really wish Linux would see a bit wider adoption. Of the three operating systems, it's by far the most pleasant to use.
Absolutely 100%

I really wish Linux would see a bit wider adoption.
I do and I don't. At least most malware leaves us alone.

Also, when looking for a program for a certain job, most things I find for linux have better quality than the garbage being churned out for Windows. Usually for free as well - well free except I feel obliged to support it, but I am happy to contribute, either in real money or time spent supporting it online in forums, or in helping with testing, or actual contribution of bug fixes.

A much nicer world indeed.
 

H-713

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Absolutely 100%


I do and I don't. At least most malware leaves us alone.

Also, when looking for a program for a certain job, most things I find for linux have better quality than the garbage being churned out for Windows. Usually for free as well - well free except I feel obliged to support it, but I am happy to contribute, either in real money or time spent supporting it online in forums, or in helping with testing, or actual contribution of bug fixes.

A much nicer world indeed.
The problem is that without slightly wider adoption, it's just not viable for too many tasks. I agree that a lot of the software for Linux is better. But... some of us are stuck using things like SolidWorks. I'd rant about LTspice not supporting Linux, but I'd rather they fix their 1995 dumpster fire of a UI. You would think Analog Devices has the money. Not that the alternatives are all that much better...

Then there are those beautiful software packages like KiCAD, Mixbus, Blender, Octave, Python, etc. that run really, really well on all three operating systems. Hats off to the developers behind those projects for doing things right and making lives easier.
 

anmpr1

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I've been really tired of Microsoft's games for years now. I've also been pretty tired of Apple's games for a few years. Both companies (but MS is worse) have this really, really aggravating habit of coming up with this idea that is, in their mind, 'the greatest thing ever', and forcing it down their users throats at all costs, no matter what it breaks.

I really wish Linux would see a bit wider adoption.
When I was in the work force, we used a lot of custom Windows applications. So that was that. The back end could be anything--I think a Unix variant. We had a lot of IBM stuff, so it might have been AIX, or possibly 360?

In the general economy (early on-line marketplace and accessing government sites), Web based applications were often Windows specific, requiring the execrable Internet Explorer. You don't see that much, anymore. Thank god.

Macs were pretty rare our in the field. In fact, I never encountered one in the workplace. I had an employee who bought her kid one of those early 'all in one' iMacs--that looked like a translucent egg. Hers was sort of a greenish teal color, I recall. I remember checking it out with her, and thinking, "This is pretty cool, in a odd-ball sort of way!"

With G5, Apple made inroads into the higher end..., 64 bit processing and such.

From a design standpoint, Macs were/are almost as visually appealing as some of the old SGI workstations. Maybe more so..., if you like white. I see their new ones are now offered in multiple colors. 'M' processor is getting great reviews in the press. For someone at home, someone with a flair for feng shui, and possessing a hefty checking account, a new iMac might be the ticket. When I go to their site, I don't see anyone that looks like me in their ads, so I know that a Mac must not be for me.

I would go back to Linux if I had to. I mean, if the frustration of Win pushed me over the cliff. But you get to the point that once you have things configured, then a major change is a major hassle. Not saying it wouldn't be worth it in the long run. I'm just sayin'...

Again, under the hood Win 11 seems OK. I don't have any complaints about that. However, the more I use the GUI, the more I wish I was back in Win Tin Ten land. I can't believe MS screwed it up so badly..., actually, I can totally believe it, considering MS's history of screwing things up badly.
 

pseudoid

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I see much disdain (hate?) for (against?) WindowsOS, in this thread!
Sad!
But the angst sounds more like a love/hate relationship than pure hate.
I am not about the chop the hand that feeds my needs.
 
F

freemansteve

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Instability increases as a function of wide hardware support and availability of third-party code.
I run Win & and various Linux on several PCs - both are stable, but something gets messed up occasionally on both, almost always down to me experimenting and tweaking!
 

pseudoid

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Instability increases as a function of wide hardware support and availability of third-party code.
Let us put a bit of perspective to this obvious statement; especially not knowing which OS the statement is in relation to (i.e., Win? Linux? Apple?)
[I am thinking that there may be a dig against Windows OperatingSystem(s) here; since the thread is about WinOS and not the other OSs.]
(#1)"...wide hardware support..." (aka legacy hw support?) >> Which happens to be one of the BEST attributes of WinOS. [I'd welcome a legitimate challenge to this imo]
(#2)"...availability of third-party code..." (BOTH software, but, as well as hardware drivers) >> Which also happens to be another one of the WinOS BEST attributes. [Again another imo and I'd welcome legit rebuttal]
(3)"Instability increases..." because of (#1) and (#2) >> but "compatibility increases" with both legacy hw and sw; making WinOS a much better choice for those who prefer 'respect for legacy' hw+sw. [I wouldn't mind a legit dis to this conclusion of mine]
I'll add one more attribute of WinOS in relation to other OperatingSystems >> Not only is there 'legacy-respect' but WinOS is the most compatible with the contender OSs (i.e., all *nix pre/post variants; each with their own unique idiosyncrasies).

Since the days of the consumer PC stone-age (DOS-era), we have all cussed-out every hal, code, firmware, kernel, run-time, os, registry, drivers, utilities, applications and apps... at one time or another; with some happily switching over to the other competing OSs. << My 'obvious statement'.:confused:

I currently run a mixture of old/new WinOS, in multiple old/new hardware installations, which also have to interface/interconnect w/competing old/new OSs and new smart/connected devices, without much of the "instability increases" you mention.
 

restorer-john

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If the hardware can be reverse engineered and cloned, I can kinda understand them being a bit paranoid about the software, especially when they sell low volumes

The Chinese appear to have done that already. The software can be downloaded and played with too.
 

Blumlein 88

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Let us put a bit of perspective to this obvious statement; especially not knowing which OS the statement is in relation to (i.e., Win? Linux? Apple?)
[I am thinking that there may be a dig against Windows OperatingSystem(s) here; since the thread is about WinOS and not the other OSs.]
(#1)"...wide hardware support..." (aka legacy hw support?) >> Which happens to be one of the BEST attributes of WinOS. [I'd welcome a legitimate challenge to this imo]
(#2)"...availability of third-party code..." (BOTH software, but, as well as hardware drivers) >> Which also happens to be another one of the WinOS BEST attributes. [Again another imo and I'd welcome legit rebuttal]
(3)"Instability increases..." because of (#1) and (#2) >> but "compatibility increases" with both legacy hw and sw; making WinOS a much better choice for those who prefer 'respect for legacy' hw+sw. [I wouldn't mind a legit dis to this conclusion of mine]
I'll add one more attribute of WinOS in relation to other OperatingSystems >> Not only is there 'legacy-respect' but WinOS is the most compatible with the contender OSs (i.e., all *nix pre/post variants; each with their own unique idiosyncrasies).

Since the days of the consumer PC stone-age (DOS-era), we have all cussed-out every hal, code, firmware, kernel, run-time, os, registry, drivers, utilities, applications and apps... at one time or another; with some happily switching over to the other competing OSs. << My 'obvious statement'.:confused:

I currently run a mixture of old/new WinOS, in multiple old/new hardware installations, which also have to interface/interconnect w/competing old/new OSs and new smart/connected devices, without much of the "instability increases" you mention.
I think you fail on premise #1 thru #3.

Especially #1 with Win 11 now refusing to install on older gear because it doesn't have the special chip. Another aspect is even in Win10 some older machines sure were supported and you could pretend to run them, but they were so slow as to be essentially unusable. Modern Linux of one kind or another will zip on some of that hardware that can barely be said to run modern Windows.

On #2 I don't think you win either though that might depend upon how you count it. I do think WinOS has a big advantage over MacOS for 3rd party code, but on Linux I'm not so sure.

#3 is laughable in the extreme. Instability.......no OS demonstrates instability like Windows can. It gets crufty and slow over time, and updates break it more often than any other OS. It has gotten better, but it hardly up to claiming wins in stability of the OS. And it doesn't win the point with #1 and #2 because you what do you do with an old Windows computer that can't cut the mustard anymore? Throw it away or put linux on it. One results in filling the landfills and another gives you a useful piece of hardware.
 

Putter

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I originally had this in another thread.

I'm the kind of person who doesn't want to get technical, just have the damn thing work. First my old Windows 7 computer decided it wouldn't connect to the internet, something along the lines of "I want to talk to you software, but you already moved on so I can't find you." Given that it was >10 years old and I inherited it, Ok it's time to buy a new computer with more memory and modern connections like an HDMI out and use the old one as a backup.

I got an ACER Aspire recommended by Amazon in its price range with 2 HDMI outs and a DVD writer and a reasonable amount of solid state to allow quick startups. It worked fine UNTIL I updated it from Win 10 to 11. It worked fine for a while and then various browsers would disappear from the Taskbar, first Chrome, then Microsoft Edge (their own browser for Chrissake!), Windows Media Player and other items. I kept downloading new browsers to stay ahead of the disappearances, Opera, Firefox,etc.

I should add that they DIDN'T ACTUALLY DISAPPEAR! They would show up on the Taskbar and when the mouse went over it a mini window would appear, but not fill out. I tried to download software from AOC for that monitor. When that didn't work further investigation found that Microsoft requires a "digital signature" without which software won't operate. There were supposedly way to bypass this software, but was unable to figure it out. I was able to download software from Intel UHD Graphics 630 for Display Adapter. This seemed to help for awhile. However the Monitor driver was still Generic PNP which was state of the art in 2006. The problems started to recur. The final straw was when the HDMI out stopped working. At this point research seemed to indicate that a full Windows 11 reinstall was needed and to my surprise it worked!

Everything worked fine for the last month until a week ago when Chrome again wouldn't pop up staying as mini window. It's been a few days and nothing else has gone wrong and got my fingers crossed.

The problems started up again. First HDMI from the computer disappeared. I finally traced it back Intel software that needed to be updated. It's not like it couldn't tell or do it automatically.

Finally some good news. As previously mentioned browsers would disappear esp. Chrome and Opera. First Chrome disappeared occasionally reappearing then disappearing. Then Opera disappeared. I fooled around a bit. That's what I do. Fix it with no idea how. Well I happened to move the taskbar to the left side from it 'default' position in the center and suddenly Chrome and Opera reappeared. It is no doubt some software glitch between the monitor and Windows 11 operating system and god knows what else. Everything has been working since then, alright for the last 3 days.
 

anmpr1

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Well I happened to move the taskbar to the left side from it 'default' position in the center and suddenly Chrome and Opera reappeared. It is no doubt some software glitch between the monitor and Windows 11 operating system and god knows what else. Everything has been working since then, alright for the last 3 days.
Sometimes you just don't know what to do. When I was growing up we had a black and white tube television. Sometimes the tuner knob wouldn't get the station in quite right. The old man would smack or punch the dial, and as if by magic, the station would lock in.

I remembered that, and when the radio in my '64 Bel Air station wagon (that I bought used for one hundred dollars in 1974) would act up, I'd pound on the dash, above the radio, and that would sometimes fix the problem.

I don't advise that you pound on your PC case, but you never know!
 

restorer-john

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I actually run the only Adobe software I still use (Acrobat Professional) in a virtual machine, simply to avoid it cluttering up my computer with all the Adobe creative cloud junk and the incessant updater prompts. It's just sad that it's come to this.

Adobe CC had so much junk going on, I killed it completely on my machines and use an old copies of Acrobat 9.0 pro extended. Apart from the odd font it can't deal with, it's rock solid and has been for around a decade.
 

MRC01

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GIMP does most of what Photoshop does. And Okular is a great PDF reader and annotator. Both are lightweight and fast compared to Adobe's apps. Not to mention free, with native versions for all 3 platforms: Linux, Mac and Windows.
 
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