Revel Concerta C10 Review (center speaker)

[Beershaun]

I understand the "best of breed" context. I just think if the breed has two legs shorter than the other two maybe the conversation should stop being "which one walks in a bigger circle" and be "stop breeding this abomination."

 

[sarumbear]

Come, come! Tell the truth now @sarumbear: which setup would you rather be in or want to possess?

We are talking about a micro centre speaker for home use and you are asking me if a studio control room is better. You seem to have a way of asking silly questions.

I spent a lot of years in rooms like that and I certainly don’t want my “home” theatre look like that.

 

[pseudoid]

"Horses for courses".

I understand the "best of breed" context.

==> "Best HORSE in the glue factory"?

 

[arisholm]

I understand the "best of breed" context. I just think if the breed has two legs shorter than the other two maybe the conversation should stop being "which one walks in a bigger circle" and be "stop breeding this abomination."

Not sure if I understood all the analogies, but my point is, a center channel speaker has a specific purpose in a surround setup that the C10 clearly fails to achieve; it cannot be properly integrated with subs in a movie setup at reasonable crossover frequencies nor output the center channel without subs. It does not have to cost a lot to achieve a better bass extension than this.

 

[pseudoid]

You have a way of asking silly questions.

Thank you! I prefer 'silly' than stiffneck. You possibly could not be the only one that has spent time in studio/control rooms. But, if I am not mistaken you prefer multi-multi speakers systems and the 'silly' old me has decided to stick w/2 speakers in a K.I.S.S. way. I don't need to shower anyone with my brilliance, but what you call 'silly' may come in handy for some who prefer to consider them. Say cheese!

 

[Sancus]

I also think [maybe a bit too much], using a center speaker means the use of 3+ total # of speakers, but a DSP (Dolby?) is used to distribute (dice and splice) the audio frequency into compartments. These 'dice-n-splice' bits that are sent to different speakers in the environment, that can potentially mess up which portions of the "compartmented" audio spectrum the Left/Right speakers are getting or not getting (<< 'impact OF the center').

Lol, wait, what? In most multi-channel content(standard 5.1, 7.1, etc), the center is just its own channel exactly the same way as L/R. Having a center is an improvement, because centered audio is not subject to acoustical crosstalk which causes cancellation dips in stereo.

DSP is only used for bass management, and object-encodings like Atmos/DTS:X. These have audio-emitting objects in 3d space and all channel outputs are calculated in real time by the processor during playback, not just the center.

 

[sarumbear]

Thank you! I prefer 'silly' than stiffneck. You possibly could not be the only one that has spent time in studio/control rooms. But, if I am not mistaken you prefer multi-multi speakers systems and the 'silly' old me has decided to stick w/2 speakers in a K.I.S.S. way. I don't need to shower anyone with my brilliance, but what you call 'silly' may come in handy for some who prefer to consider them. Say cheese!

Comparing a studio control room to a small centre speaker and asking me which one I prefer is pretty silly and it has nothing to do with number of speakers you prefer.

Besides, I have separate theatre and music rooms. The latter has just two speaker.

 

[sam_adams]

The Revel Concerta C10 series is specifically designed to be mounted on a wall. Mounting it any other fashion essentially defeats the intended design.

From the marketing 'features':

The performance of Revel Concerta™ on-wall loudspeakers has been extensively evaluated in a variety of on-and near-wall installations through blind listening tests in the Revel Multichannel Listening Lab.

Using proprietary 36-point anechoic measurements, Concerta on-wall speakers have been shown to deliver remarkably flat frequency response across an exceptionally wide listening area for clean, accurate sound in real-world listening rooms.

None of the competing systems tested under identical conditions performed as well. Remarkably, Revel engineers could not identify a single competing on-wall system they considered suitable for on-wall use, based on either laboratory measurements or double-blind listening tests.

With advanced drivers utilizing Micro Ceramic Composite (MCC) cones and domes, along with high-order crossovers, and housed in rigid aluminum enclosures styled to complement the look of LCD and plasma displays, Concerta on-wall systems will fill any room with brilliant, distortion-free sound from virtually any amplifier.

Concerta speakers are voice-matched for use in any combination to build movie and music systems of uncommon realism. The series includes an innovative 3-channel LCR system mounted in a single enclosure, a highly capable center channel speaker, a choice of satellites and an impressive 250-watt powered subwoofer. The B120 sub can be connected directly to your system or operated wirelessly with an optional transmitter, for complete placement freedom.

All Concerta on-wall woofer, midrange and tweeter diaphragms are constructed of Micro Ceramic Composite (MCC), a new material created by anodizing both sides of an aluminum core. Anodizing both sides of an aluminum core adds strength and stiffness – but very little weight – to a material already well suited for use in transducer diaphragms.

With appropriate hardware, it’s possible to affix virtually any compact loudspeaker to a listening room wall, and manufacturers are free to promote any model of a certain size and weight as “wall-mountable.” But very few audio manufacturers have the facilities and expertise needed to determine just how their on-wall systems will sound when actually placed on or near a wall.

Revel had a whole line of on-wall systems recently.

 

[sarumbear]

The Revel Concerta C10 series is specifically designed to be mounted on a wall. Mounting it any other fashion essentially defeats the intended design.

@amirm in-line with Revel’s above declaration will you consider retesting in 2Pi space?

 

[amirm]

@amirm in-line with Revel’s above declaration will you consider retesting in 2Pi space?

I listened to them in front of my LCD TV. If you mean measure it that way, it is not possible to build a massive wall for Klippel NFS. I can try to make in-room measurement however.

 

[sam_adams]

I listened to them in front of my LCD TV. If you mean measure it that way, it is not possible to build a massive wall for Klippel NFS. I can try to make in-room measurement however.

@Maiky76 seems to be our resident Matlab/Octave guru. Maybe he can run up a simulation based on the already gathered data to save @amirm some extra work. We would have—at least—some idea of the differences in response depending on how the speaker is mounted and measured. However, I don't want to be volunteering anyone's time or effort—especially Amir's.

 

[beagleman]

The Revel Concerta C10 series is specifically designed to be mounted on a wall. Mounting it any other fashion essentially defeats the intended design.

Concerta on-wall speakers have been shown to deliver remarkably flat frequency response across an exceptionally wide listening area for clean, accurate sound in real-world listening rooms.

None of the competing systems tested under identical conditions performed as well. Remarkably, Revel engineers could not identify a single competing on-wall system they considered suitable for on-wall use, based on either laboratory measurements or double-blind listening tests.

Marketing talk of course, but "Exceptionally wide"? uh I guess, kinda sorta......it for sure does have some strengths, but not sure that is one.

Wall placement tends to make ALL speakers such as this have a boomy 120-150 hz range. Perhaps filtering out this area removes that annoying carboard box sound for sure. But it also limits usability, in most home theatres.

 

[sam_adams]

Marketing talk of course, but "Exceptionally wide"? uh I guess, kinda sorta......it for sure does have some strengths, but not sure that is one.

Wall placement tends to make ALL speakers such as this have a boomy 120-150 hz range. Perhaps filtering out this area removes that annoying carboard box sound for sure. But it also limits usability, in most home theatres.

Since we know what the response is:

Mounting on a wall as intended in combination with the high pass filtering might not result in the elevated levels for a similar design without the HP filter. Since these are on-wall designs, these probably fit more of a Marie Kondo lifestyle choice rather than the whole full-blown HT.

 

[escape2]

The purpose of this speaker is to be a supplement to help center voices, is it not?

It is not.

The purpose of a center channel speaker is to reproduce human voices FULLY, so that the subwoofer doesn't have to. You don't want actors' voices coming from your subwoofer. You want actor's voices anchored to the TV screen.

 

[MediumRare]

It is not.

The purpose of a center channel speaker is to reproduce human voices FULLY, so that the subwoofer doesn't have to. You don't want actors' voices coming from your subwoofer. You want actor's voices anchored to the TV screen.

You're forgetting this is intended (as per Revel's specific description) to be used with L&R full-range speakers, not only with a sub.

WRT your last statement, that is also incorrect: If there are frequencies within the sub's desired range, it doesn't matter what the "thing" is making the sound - a voice, a canon, thunder; it is all omnidirectional and not located as coming "from" the subwoofer.

 

[Inner Space]

The purpose of a center channel speaker is to reproduce human voices FULLY

Exactly right. The center channel carries the narrative and emotional weight of the production. The center speaker should be the very best in the room, not some added-on, half-baked afterthought.

 

[Inner Space]

You're forgetting this is intended (as per Revel's specific description) to be used with L&R full-range speakers, not only with a sub.

Most mch mixes have no (or very little) dialog L&R. It's all down to the center. Missing vocal fundamentals are a problem.

 

[sam_adams]

You're forgetting this is intended (as per Revel's specific description) to be used with L&R full-range speakers, not only with a sub.

WRT your last statement, that is also incorrect: If there are frequencies within the sub's desired range, it doesn't matter what the "thing" is making the sound - a voice, a canon, thunder; it is all omnidirectional and not located as coming "from" the subwoofer.

The Concerta C10 was meant to be used with a pair of the Concerta M10s as LR speakers.

 

[sarumbear]

It is not.

The purpose of a center channel speaker is to reproduce human voices FULLY, so that the subwoofer doesn't have to. You don't want actors' voices coming from your subwoofer. You want actor's voices anchored to the TV screen.

A subwoofer works at most 100Hz. What human voice is there at that frequency?

 

[beagleman]

The Concerta C10 was meant to be used with a pair of the Concerta M10s as LR speakers.

But with a 5.1 or 7.1 sound mix, ONLY the center will have voices (for 95% or so scenes in movies) and what is lacking in the center, will not be filled in by other speakers.

It is a dedicated channel. The only way to "Fix" that is have either a sub or the left/right do the bass, but be crossed over very high.